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GDJMSP View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GDJMSP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Nov 2006 at 12:34pm
Originally posted by coin crazy!! coin crazy!! wrote:

do coin values raise with the silver and gold value.I've heard that a couple of times.
 
They do to a degree, but typically only when the value of the coin is very close to the value of its bullion content.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GDJMSP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Nov 2006 at 12:37pm
Originally posted by coldshot coldshot wrote:

How long before the liberal's take the motto off of our money?
 
 
If I have anything to say about it - never.  A brief article I wrote on the subject a few years ago -
 
 

"IN GOD WE TRUST"


Few things have ever created so much and such long-lived controversy in the history of our nation as those four little words. Those four words are one of the Official Mottoes of the United States of America. The other is E Pluribus Unum. And as such they appear on every coin and every Federal Reserve note produced in our nation today.

The nation is divided into two basic camps regarding this subject; those who think the Motto should be changed and removed from our coins and currency; and those who think it should remain. Both camps have their reasons for their ideals and both are resolutely certain that their ideal is the correct one.

Those who wish the Motto to be changed and removed base their thinking on the idea of the separation of church & state and claim that such a Motto is not a part of our nation's heritage. That it is but a recent addition and as such had no place in the founding of our nation. And that based on the idea of the separation of church & state such a Motto is unconstitutional. Those who wish the Motto to remain unchanged refute these claims in every way. It is a difficult subject for many people to consider in which camp they belong. For others, they have no problem. They know on which side of the fence they stand and defend their position with vigor.

A simple search of the Internet for the words "In God We Trust" will bring up enough links on both sides of the issue to keep a person reading for weeks. But for myself there are really only two questions that need asking. Is the Motto actually rooted in the very beginnings of our nation's heritage? And does the Motto contradict the idea of the separation of church & state?

The first question is easily answered for me. There were 56 men who signed the Declaration of Independence in 1776 - the very beginning of our nation. This is the pledge that those 56 men made - "For the support of this declaration, with firm reliance on the protection of the divine providence, we mutually pledge to each other, our lives, our fortunes, and our sacred honor." It seems rather hard to argue that "In God We Trust" and "firm reliance on the protection of the divine providence" do not convey the same meaning. And how much further back can you go into our nation's heritage than the signing of the Declaration of Independence?

Then of course you can examine our National Anthem - written in 1814. The words of the third from the last line of the fourth stanza are - "And this is our motto - 'In God is our Trust!" Now somebody will say those words are not in our National Anthem. But "The Star Spangled Banner" is actually a poem that was put to music. And only the first stanza of the poem was used in the song.

So it seems to me that when Congress decided to place the Motto "In God We Trust" on some of our coins back in the 1860's they were only too aware of just how much those words are a part of our nation's heritage. Perhaps we have forgotten it.

As for the second question; this nation was founded on the idea of freedom of religion. Because at the time, in most nations of the world there was only one religion acceptable in any given nation -that being the State Religion of the given nation. And the founders of our nation wanted to make sure that was not the case here - which they did.

The First Amendment of the Constitution states - "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof......" Seems rather obvious to me what that means. That the Congress shall not make any law that establishes a State Religion. That is what is meant by and what was intended by our founding fathers to maintain a separation of church & state.

Perhaps - we have forgotten too much.

 
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GDJMSP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Nov 2006 at 12:42pm
Originally posted by coldshot coldshot wrote:

Originally posted by coin crazy!! coin crazy!! wrote:

do coin values raise with the silver and gold value.I've heard that a couple of times.

It appear's to me the coin industry is a market of it's own and does not follow the metal market?
 
 
Absolutely, that is because the value of a given coin is based on its numismatic value and not its bullion content.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote silverhawk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Nov 2006 at 1:48pm
Originally posted by coin crazy!! coin crazy!! wrote:

do coin values raise with the silver and gold value.I've heard that a couple of times.
 
Silver and Gold can have a direct impact on many coins. St Gaudens went up with gold, and stayed (to some extent) even when gold dropped. These coins also went up MORE than gold did as people wanted to grab higher grades. Those coins whose values are largely bullion based (American eagles for instance) are directly impacted.
 
Others with true collector (or numismatic value) are largely unaffected.


Edited by silverhawk - 02 Nov 2006 at 1:49pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote silverhawk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Nov 2006 at 1:51pm
Nice job, GDJMSP
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote coin crazy!! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Nov 2006 at 2:06pm
Okay,how about the most vauble coin.Or the highest  record  coin sold?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GDJMSP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Nov 2006 at 2:16pm
Originally posted by coin crazy!! coin crazy!! wrote:

Okay,how about the most vauble coin.Or the highest  record  coin sold?
 
 
They are two different things - highest price paid was for the '33 double eagle - $7,590,020
 
So far anyway, most valuable coin is a 1000 mohur of Jahangir. In 1987 it went up for auction, bid reached $10 million, but the owner turned it down as too low.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote coin crazy!! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Nov 2006 at 2:19pm

Wow,that is high.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote coldshot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Nov 2006 at 3:53am
Originally posted by coin crazy!! coin crazy!! wrote:

do coin values raise with the silver and gold value.I've heard that a couple of times.

When gold was between 6 and 700.00 gold buffs first strike NGC ms 70 were 750.00 now gold is down and the buff's are up. This is an interesting subject.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote coldshot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Nov 2006 at 3:55am
Good job Silverhawk this is the best folder here.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote coldshot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Nov 2006 at 4:04am
Why was the motto left off of some St Gauden's?
What is wire rim on a coin?
What is high relief?
What is a TOP POP coin?
Why will no one give me a St Gauden's any condition?
When money is completly out of use and circulation will we still collect coin's or collect old credit card's?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote josie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Nov 2006 at 7:23am
Novice queation from novice like me.
 
Seen interesting topichere, Having problem deducting this but here it goes.
 
Govt-mint- collector or investor-grading comp.-auction house-insurance-coinmarket-currency-Govt
 
when a mint relaese a coin for sale for collector and investor they buy it more or less their face value,
 
then a coll. or invst. find an error more than thier face value then graded more tha again there face value. then the govt. tax the comp.
 
then the coll. sold the coin to the auction house both tax by the govt. again. the coin in transit insured and the govt tax the insurane company.
 
then the collector insured the coin at home tax again.
 
for that piece of metal that is insured already a monetary value of its own,
what is the real price of the coin specailly the highly collectable and expensive and slab?
 
It is just a metal or it is already a currency of the state of its own for all the process it went through?
 
Also for raw coins highly collectible and expensive but not insured and slab what is thier value?
 
And for coin raw and slab both expensive and insured what is thier value are they a currency or just a piece of metal?
 
Just thinking slab and insured coin can contribute to the purchasing value of dollar,or  it must have the market.
 
What happen hypothetical. very few people buy or collect coin what happen to the insured and slab coins with high value.?
 
 
 
One can be trusted in small things can be also trusted in bigger things
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote coin crazy!! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Nov 2006 at 7:49am
I high relief I think is the lettering in a coin that shows up more.Like the words on a Eisenhower dollar.On the Back  the words"In god we trust"The words are thicker.Just giving an thought.
 
Note from Silverhawk: Those would be different types. Relief can describe the design, but high relief is a specific design with extra high and low details, and possibly special striking to create a "deep" design.


Edited by silverhawk - 04 Nov 2006 at 12:30am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote just carl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Nov 2006 at 1:24pm
Originally posted by silverhawk silverhawk wrote:

Nice job, GDJMSP
I'll second that. Great article.
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